President Erdoğan said "Just as we strive, with the world watching in awe, to establish peace both in our region and in different geographical locations of the world, we will do everything in our power to ensure that peace and tranquility will always prevail on both sides of the Aegean Sea."
President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan spoke to Greek Kathimerini newspaper ahead of Greek Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis' visit to Ankara.
In response to the question, "Mr. President, in your statement regarding the visit of Kyriakos Mitsotakis to Ankara, you mentioned that you will talk with him “about how relations between the two countries can be improved.” Are you satisfied with the level of bilateral relations? What is the goal and how can it be achieved?" President Erdoğan stated the following:
"The goal is simple: To consolidate our friendship and raise the level of our bilateral relations to a level unprecedented in history, by solving our problems. To this end, we in Türkiye have recently taken sincere and effective steps, and we intend to continue."
Noting that Türkiye and Greece share not only the same geography but also many common elements of historical dimension, President Erdoğan assessed: "Of course, there are issues on which we disagree, but the number of issues on which we can agree is not small. By speaking openly and courageously about all issues together, we can take steps towards a solution."
Underscoring that procrastination did not solve problems, and stating that it was necessary to overcome them with courage and show a will to resolve them, President Erdoğan continued to say: "Just as we strive, with the world watching in awe, to establish peace both in our region and in different geographical locations of the world, so we will do everything in our power to ensure that peace and tranquility will always prevail on both sides of the Aegean Sea. It’s easy to destroy something. The hard part is building and solving problems skillfully. Therefore, it is up to us to relax the relations between the two countries, which are trying to squeeze themselves between two walls, and to tear down those walls, which are full of prejudices. All we need are solution-oriented and honest historical steps."
When posed the question, "How was your meeting with Mitsotakis in Athens? Is your communication with him at the level you desire?" President Erdoğan replied; "I believe that we have achieved a climate of harmony with Mr. Mitsotakis recently. They displayed hospitality that satisfied us in Athens. Of course, when we host Mr. Mitsotakis in Ankara, we will demonstrate one of the rarest examples of Turkish hospitality.”
Stating that the climate he mentioned had started to bear fruit; President Erdoğan noted; "The Athens Declaration, the agreements and protocols we signed are just some of them. There is no barrier to adding new ones. I can say that very good relations have been established not only between us, but also at the level of ministers and bureaucrats. In conclusion, our communication is satisfactory on many levels and it is very likely that we will move forward in a positive way."
"Everyone knows how sensitive we are on the environment"
In response to the question, "Recently, Ankara reacted to the steps Greece wanted to take regarding the creation of two marine parks in the Ionian and Aegean seas. While Athens says this is an environmental matter, Türkiye's Foreign Ministry raised the issue of “island sovereignty.” Mr Mitsotakis stated that Greece will declare the marine parks. Can dialogue move forward when questions are raised not only of exploitation rights at sea but also of sovereignty over land?; President Erdoğan made the following remarks:
"Raising issues of sovereignty is not something that damages the grounds of dialogue and hinders its progress. We can protect this ground under any circumstances and ensure progress. These matters already have a special place on the list of issues that we have to deal with. We can discuss these issues with a perspective that is far from any fait accompli and adopt an approach that believes in the solution. However, a "fait accompli" approach would inflict the greatest damage to the ground of dialogue . Everyone knows how sensitive we, as Türkiye, are on the environment. However, it would be wrong to see this as a convenient screen for hiding other controversial situations behind it."
Stating that every issue must be assessed in its own context, President Erdoğan voiced his opinions as follows: “Just like a building constructed on a weak ground would collapse in a short time; theses with unsound historic, legal and ideal foundations are bound to fall flat. For instance, you cannot even build a shack on a random spot without having a valid title deed. This is a de-facto situation which has legal repercussions and sanctions. Everyone knows that Türkiye will not accept de-facto situations in this region."
"We have always shown the necessary reaction to any attempts to ignore Türkiye"
Greece considers the agreements signed between Türkiye and Libya (GNA) invalid and Türkiye considers the agreements between Greece and Egypt invalid with regard to the delimitation of maritime jurisdiction areas. Likewise, a number of agreements between Cyprus and Israel are considered invalid by Türkiye. In such an environment, can we talk about any cooperation between Greece and Türkiye on hydrocarbons?
"Let’s start by making a correction. In your question, you mentioned an agreement between Cyprus and Israel. It is only an assumption that the entire island of Cyprus has signed an agreement delineating its maritime exclusive economic zone with Israel. This agreement, which we do not recognize, was signed between the Greek administration of southern Cyprus and Israel, while the rights and interests of Turkish Cypriots, who constitute an essential element of the island, i.e. of the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus, have been ignored. On the other hand, for us, energy is not an area of conflict, but an area of cooperation. For this reason, approaching the subject from a positive angle is more than enough.
Drawing attention to the fact that Türkiye had consistently advocated and consistently called for a fair and inclusive distribution of hydrocarbon resources, President Erdoğan continued:
"As on all matters, we want our sovereign rights and powers to be respected, as we also respect the rights and principles of coastal countries. However, we have always shown the necessary reaction to any attempts to ignore Türkiye. In addition, we have made an open call and stated that a basis for an inclusive energy cooperation must be created and that we will support the steps to be taken for it.
"Everyone should know that it is difficult for an energy platform that does not include Türkiye to succeed in the region, especially in the Eastern Mediterranean. By convening the Eastern Mediterranean conference that we have been talking about for years, it is possible to create a basis for a solution with a win-win approach.
Upon expressing that their appeals on this matter had so far gone unanswered, President Erdoğan went on to say:
"I have emphasized at every opportunity that this proposal, which has significant potential to ensure a healthy dialogue in the region, should be adopted by other actors as well. I think such a step will facilitate cooperation and contribute to the diversity and security of resources. Unfortunately, steps that ignore the rights of Türkiye and the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus have poisoned the atmosphere on this issue so far. If we abandon this and lay the grounds for dialogue that we desire, we are ready to take responsibility for a permanent solution. You can’t get anywhere with tension. It should be understood that getting caught up in provocations benefits no one and ways should be sought to reach a reasonable point.”
"We have full confidence that focusing on concrete and constructive ideas would bring us into the path to solution"
In response to the question, "The positions of the two countries on the subject of the Aegean continental shelf are well known. No change in the attitude of the two countries is expected. Would you accept the mediation of an institution such as the International Court of Justice in The Hague to resolve the long-running dispute?, President Erdoğan stated the following:
"The solution here is clear, the solution is to comply with international law and make it viable. As long as we don’t avoid it, there shouldn’t be any obstacles we can’t overcome together. As you know, we advocate that problems should be solved as a package. We should not ignore other controversial points by focusing on a single difference. When we say that we have arrived at a comprehensive solution, we must not pass down frictions to future generations. Our priority is clear. Our approach to finding solutions through peaceful means in accordance with international law is the key to eliminating problems. We do not rule out solutions inscribed in the UN Charter, if necessary. We express this clearly at every opportunity. We have full confidence that focusing on concrete and constructive ideas would bring us into the path of solution; as long as we do not say, 'Let’s solve this problem while the others remain unsolved,' and choose to tackle the problems together.
With regard to the developments in Gaza, President Erdoğan was asked; "We would like to discuss the developments in Gaza. You have criticized Israel for its actions in Gaza, likening Benjamin Netanyahu to the “Hitler of our time,” and supported Hamas, which Israel and Western countries deem terrorists, as a “liberation movement.” Could you clarify Türkiye’s stance on this issue?", which he gave the following response:
Seeing what Israel has brought upon the people of Gaza for months, can one justify Israel’s bombings of hospitals, killing of children, oppression of civilians, and condemning innocent people to hunger, thirst, and lack of medicine under various pretexts as legitimate? Reflecting on history, what did Hitler do? He oppressed and killed people in concentration camps. Hasn’t Gaza effectively become an open-air prison, not only since October 7 but also for years prior? Haven’t the people there been condemned to limited resources for years, akin to conditions in a concentration camp? Who bears responsibility for the most brutal and systematic mass murders in Gaza since October 7? How should we perceive Israel, which instructs people to “go to that area” and then bombs it? Netanyahu’s actions have reached a level that would make Hitler envious of his genocidal methods."
Noting that they were discussing Israel, which targets ambulances, strikes food distribution points, and fires upon humanitarian convoys, President Erdoğan went on to say: " Dozens of rights and freedoms of Gazan residents are violated, particularly the right to life. We stand up for their rights. We advocate for peace. Conversely, Israel recklessly flouts United Nations resolutions, international law, and human rights. Consider this: What would you do if someone entered your home and declared, “This place is now mine, leave”? Would you say, “come live in my house and take it away from me”? Or would you defend your home? Naturally, you would defend your home and resist injustice.
"What does Hamas seek? To reclaim Palestinian lands occupied by Israel"
Underscoring that Israel has done this not only in Gaza but in all Palestinian territories, President Erdoğan stated the following: "It seized Palestinian homes and lands for terrorists it called 'settlers'. It placed them in Palestinian homes. Faced with this systematic and long-standing oppression, Palestinians eventually organized and began to resist. Hamas and other Palestinian resistance groups, which the West is trying to label as terrorists, effectively emerged in response to this oppression."
Noting that Hamas is nothing but people protecting their homes, businesses, and lands occupied by Israel in Palestine, President Erdoğan said: " What does Hamas seek? To reclaim Palestinian lands occupied by Israel and restore their state. If a sovereign, independent, geographically contiguous state of Palestine were recognized within the 1967 borders, with East Jerusalem as its capital, would there still be a need for resistance? Furthermore, Hamas has stated that in such a scenario, it would dissolve its armed wing and transition into a political party. A two-state solution offers a viable path toward lasting and sustainable peace."
President Erdoğan went on to say: "You see, in its latest statement, Hamas agreed to a ceasefire. But Israel does not want a ceasefire, citing excuses due to its desire to occupy all of Gaza. Oppression and bloodshed persist. In the meantime, we continue our pursuit of a solution. Those who support Israel must reconsider these events and align with those advocating for peace and tranquility, bearing a sense of historical responsibility.
"Our visit to the USA was postponed due to conflicting schedules on both sides"
When asked about the reason why their scheduled meeting with US President Joe Biden was suddenly postponed, and whether he believed that the United States should play a mediating role in Turkish-Greek relations, President Erdoğan made the following remarks:
As you know, the United States is on the eve of elections, and Mr. Biden’s schedule has become even busier. Our programs continue intensively both domestically and internationally. Such visits are scheduled when suitable for both parties. Efforts are underway to determine a suitable date, with our colleagues, engaging in discussions with their counterparts. We would rather the US maintained its policy of balance in its relations with Türkiye and Greece. We, Greece and the USA are NATO members. We believe that maintaining a distance in line with the rules of the alliance, fostering constructive dialogue, will be beneficial. Nevertheless, we have direct contact with Greece, with no need for intermediaries. Sustaining and developing this will make further positive contributions to our relations.
"Efforts persist to reopen the Theological School of Heybeliada (Halki)"
In reply to the question, "There are views expressed that the reopening of the Theological School of Heybeliada (Halki) would be a positive step for Türkiye regarding religious freedoms. The school has remained closed for decades, and you have been in power for 22 years. Do you intend to take any action on this matter?", President Erdoğan remarked that their position on this matter was clear.
"We hold a deep respect for the rights of minorities, and our sensibility towards this issue is profound. The Greek Orthodox minority in our country benefits from both the right to equality as citizens and minority rights. The issue surrounding the Theological School of Heybeliada (Halki) emerged in 1971 when all private higher education institutions were nationalized pursuant to a decision by the Constitutional Court. With no tertiary education institution available for the transfer of the Theological School, the legal basis was compromised. The Patriarchate opposed the proposal to integrate the school’s operations within a state university under the legislation of the Higher Education Council. Efforts persist to reopen the Theological School of Heybeliada (Halki). We anticipate the same constructive approach from our neighbor regarding the challenges faced by the Turkish minority in Greece in the realm of education."
“We do not hesitate to extend a hand of friendship as long as there is a response”
To the question, “More than a year has passed without tension in and over the Aegean Sea. Do you agree that the abstention from military action can and should be maintained, regardless of any progress in the bilateral disputes?”President Erdoğan gave the following answer:
“As we say, it is always important to maintain the basis of dialogue and cooperation. We are not in favor of tension. Just as we have no designs on the rights of others, we do not want anyone to show disrespect for our rights. Continuing a behavior that respects sensitivities ensures that an atmosphere without tension prevails; we experienced this together. This calmness is a sign of how necessary it is for relationships to develop on a fair basis. We do not hesitate to extend a hand of friendship as long as there is a response. We value friendship and good-neighborly relations. As long as no steps are taken that can harm that, this attitude will continue.”
“On the issue of irregular migration there must be international cooperation and an equal distribution of burdens and responsibilities”
When asked about his opinion on the level of cooperation with Greece in controlling illegal migration, President Erdoğan responded as follows:
“In this area, the contacts and exchange of information between our authorities produced important results and this continues. On the other hand, as we always emphasize, in the issue of irregular migration there must be international cooperation and an equal distribution of burdens and responsibilities. For permanent solutions, it is obvious that we must continue to work with a multifaceted scheme. The cooperation of all those involved in the matter will pave the way for us to move forward on a fast, efficient and sound basis.”
“We have successfully passed the honesty test on this matter dozens of times”
In response to a question about whether he thought there were other areas of economic cooperation that could be mutually beneficial, noting that the implementation of the tourist visa had already yielded good results, President Erdoğan remarked that their basic approach in diplomacy is “win-win” principle
Stating that both Türkiye and Greece are two important tourism countries, President Erdoğan went on to say:
“Our citizens have the opportunity to easily travel to the Greek islands by applying for a visa at the gate. In fact, all this should not be necessary and the European Union should liberalize the visa regime for Türkiye. We want to make progress on this matter. We believe there are areas where we can have mutual benefits with Greece, such as visa at the (entry) gate. When we approach issues with a positive agenda, we can make progress in many areas, especially in our trade relations, and benefit our countries. For example, the abolition of quotas applied to road transport vehicles and the liberalization of the transit regime can allow us to more easily achieve our goals by increasing our trade volume very quickly. The win-win principle is not just in words, we are honest and have successfully passed the honesty test in this matter dozens of times. The win-win principle is not just in words, we are honest and have successfully passed the honesty test in this matter dozens of times. When we see an honest approach in front of us, it will be very easy to create new opportunities for mutual gain.”
“The Athens Declaration marked the dawn of a new phase in our relations”
Upon the question “In the more than 20 years you’ve been in power, which moments would you identify as the best and the worst in Türkiye-Greece relations?”, President Erdoğan made the following assessments:
“ Here, I would like to refer to positive issues and express them… But to answer your question, after the treacherous coup attempt of FETO and the coup attempt that took place in our country on July 15, 2016, the terrorists sought refuge in neighboring Greece and Greece protected and harbored the coup plotters, purportedly from the military, despite the bonds of neighborliness and the alliance between us. This can be considered one of the lowest points in our relations. This didn’t hurt only me; it hurt our people, who resisted with their own hands and repelled the coup plotters, purportedly from the military, by writing an epic of democracy. It was deeply disappointing that Greece, which understands the gravity of coups through its historical experiences, adopted such a stance.
The Athens Declaration, signed last December, possibly represents a pinnacle in our relations. The declaration marked the dawn of a new phase in our relations. Of course, we do not view this as adequate and strive for further improvement. I believe this declaration will serve as the foundation for revitalized Greek-Turkish relations, aspiring to set new benchmarks.”